In this conversation, Allan Dib and I explore the principles of lean marketing and the importance of integrating marketing throughout the business process. Allan shares insights on how to create valuable marketing content that resonates with your audience, the significance of implementation beyond delivering mere information, and the role of storytelling in nonfiction writing. We also discuss effective email marketing strategies and how to build genuine connections with readers.
Allan Dib is best known as the author of The 1-Page Marketing Plan and Lean Marketing. His books have sold over a million copies worldwide and have been translated into over 40 languages. Allan helps businesses implement marketing best practices in-house using his 1-Page Marketing Plan (1PMP) framework and lean marketing methodology.
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Lean marketing for authors, with Allan Dib | Episode 244 Transcript
These transcripts were generated by robots, not writers.
Stacy: Welcome. Welcome. This week we are going to be talking about a topic that a lot of my author clients really struggle with when they near the launch of their book and even after the launch of their book, and that is marketing. And I’m excited specifically about today’s guest because his focus is really on making marketing simple and effective, measuring what matters, and also creating extraordinary experiences for the people that you eventually get to serve. So let me introduce you to this week’s guest. Alan Dibb is best known as the author of the One Page Marketing Plan and Lean Marketing. His books have sold over a million copies worldwide and have been translated into over 40 languages. He helps businesses implement marketing best practices in house using his One Page Marketing Plan framework and Lean Marketing methodology. Ellen, welcome.
Allan: Hey, Stacy, it’s so good to be on.
Stacy: I loved Lean Marketing, the book Lean Marketing, and we have been reading it as a team and once we got done reading it, I knew I needed to reach out to you because so much of what you break down in your methodology is really accessible for people that kind of get the ick when it comes to marketing. You know, it just like feels really bad to them when they think about marketing their book, their business, their brand. I would love for you to just start us off with what lean marketing is. How does it also solve for this, you know, this feeling that people have when they come into it. And how can adopting lean marketing transform a business or brand?
Allan: Yeah, so Lean marketing is basically a methodology to implement marketing in a way that is integrated throughout your whole business. So to put it in, you know, language that you’ve already put it in, it’s marketing that basically is not going to give you the ick. You’re not going to have to go have a shower with a steel wire brush after doing it. Because a lot of times people do people feel like marketing is this necessary evil. You know, we’ve got our product, we’ve got our service, and then we’ve got to do all this slimy stuff to get people to buy from us. But when I looked at the best marketers in the world, they had marketing integrated throughout their whole product life cycle, or service life cycle, depending on what they were selling. And marketing was part of the product.
Allan: And the better the product, the better the marketing was. And so an approach that so many people have taken over the years and failed with is, hey, we’ve built this product, we’ve built this service, now let’s sprinkle some marketing on top. And often they find, you know, the market doesn’t either want what they want or there’s not a big need or there’s not a gap in the marketplace. And so now they have to do all of this sort of pushy tactics, this overhyped things, promises that they really can’t deliver on. And so what lean marketing is a simple nine step methodology that will really take you through the whole marketing process and do it in a way that’s integrated and that aligns brand’s values.
Stacy: I love the values component. And I also really appreciated in your book how you really made a point that it doesn’t just end once somebody’s been sold to and that marketing really extends through the entire experience, especially the beginning of working with somebody and how they are well served. And it’s interesting because I know earlier in my business when I started getting much more serious with my marketing, getting more consistent with it, I focused way too much on metrics and I let, I wouldn’t say I let it go, but I kind of forgot about the thing that was feeding my business, which was referrals and some of the things that I had been doing already that were working really well.
Stacy: And I imagine that you see this a lot, that people get really excited about adopting something and they run so far in a new direction that they forget about the thing that actually has worked for them for so long. And then they kind of have to course correct or maybe they just decide that marketing doesn’t work. I don’t know. What, what have you seen in your experience?
Allan: Yeah, all of those things and like a key cornerstone of lean marketing. So I’ve got nine principles of lean marketing. The, the very first one, and I, I would think of it as probably the most important one is your marketing should be so valuable that people would potentially pay just to receive your marketing. You know, so a lot of times we think of marketing and it’s become that because we’ve seen the loudest people do this. It’s become interruption. It’s the ad that interrupts your content. It’s the spam that lands in your inbox. It’s the, you know, cold call that you get that’s unwanted. So we’ve all seen that, we’ve felt that and a lot of people feel that’s what marketing is. Whereas I think of marketing in a way that hey, it’s content.
Allan: You know, There was a guy, Howard Gossage, I think his name is, I might be butchering his name, probably am. But he basically said people don’t Read ads. People read what interests them and sometimes that’s an ad. Right. So very similar, from what we’ve seen, that really works with social media is people consume the content that interests them. And sometimes it’s a commercial, it’s got commercial content or it’s got it intertwined. But if you think of your marketing as, hey, this is a public service, kind of like if you were doing a public service for your community, that’s something that’s the mindset I want people to have around marketing.
Stacy: Which is interesting because I think especially for people that are stepping into a new phase of their marketing or really wanting to get serious about their marketing, they worry that they’re going to give away too much and that suddenly they won’t have anything to sell anymore. How do you think about that for people that hold that fear?
Allan: Yeah, I hear that all the time. And honestly, if you’ve got a good idea, you’re probably going to need to ram it down people’s throats. Your problem is not going to be people stealing it, but it’s going to be people actually implementing it. Because having been in the information business for, you know, now about a decade, I know that how hard it is to get people to actually implement the stuff that you suggest, even when they agree it’s a good idea, even when they say they’re going to do it. And so 99% of your audience is just not going to do anything with what you. The content that you create for them. So they’ll consume it, they’ll bookmark it, they’ll say they’re going to do it later or whatever. So the real value is not information. Information is not scarce anymore.
Allan: We’ve got Wikipedia, we’ve got chat GPT, we’ve language models, we’ve got Google, we’ve got, you know, YouTube. It’s the how to engine. So what’s valuable is implementation. So if you can walk someone through, you know, I can give you, in fact, my book Lean Marketing. It outlines everything that we do as a business, exactly how we would implement marketing for you. You can get that book potentially on Kindle, I think for like $2.99. But people pay us a lot of money to guide them, to help them through safely to the other side, to really help accelerate their results. And we have a business that does multimillion dollar figures because people want that experience even though the information is right there.
Allan: They can have that for almost free if they want to, or pretty much free if they look it up on The Internet or whatever. So information is abundant, it’s not scarce. But now what’s becoming more and more scarce is people with DOM knowledge really helping you implement the stuff. And I think those experiences are going to become much more valuable. So community, that’s something that we’re really investing in right now. Like physical live events because they’re hard to scale. AI can’t really do that, at least not yet. The one to one connection with people. So those are the things that kind of don’t scale. They’re not, you know, easily replicated in digital form. And so those are the things that are gonna become more and more valuable because they’re more and more scarce.
Stacy: Oh, that’s so interesting. And it fits for me. That really makes sense. This is our first year doing our first writing retreat here in Portugal, where I live. And it was like just. I just felt like we needed it, you know. And also I have an author’s community and they were asking for it regularly. When are we doing a retreat? When can we do the retreat? So, you know, to your point, this is what we are craving. The more we become fractured and disappear, disconnected. I want to go back a little bit to the point about giving too much away. And basically that you can’t. Because ultimately what people need is somebody to help them implement.
Stacy: And it strikes me, I didn’t think about this actually until you just said this, but what you do and what I do are very similar in the sense that I often joke that I teach the hardest thing there is to do, which is write a book. This is a lifelong goal people hold. It takes a lot of attention, follow through, discipline, thought. You’re doing something that requires delayed gratification. Right? Because you have to get all the things in motion. It takes time to see results. And what I’m curious about, I’d like to go a little bit behind the curtain, if you’re willing to, on your book writing process and how you thought about this book being part of your larger offerings. And when you wrote it to your point, you’re very generous. It didn’t feel like you were gatekeeping anything.
Stacy: And then you also have a bunch of resources that you can actually get, you know, templates and tools and things. How did you think about this in your own author process? Were you really strategic in how you created this book? Was it more. And I guess you had, you have two. So maybe we can talk about your first one and then your second one. Maybe you can share a little bit of that process as an author and business owner.
Allan: Sure. So I’ll talk about the first book. So I already had the consulting and coaching business and most definitely I wrote the book to for a few reasons. So first of all, it’s the book I wish I had when I was in the trenches in my first business, when I was a dead broke IT geek, I just didn’t know how to get a client. I went to every seminar, I read every book, I did all the stuff and I definitely got value from each. I got a little piece from here. And for me it was the. I just wrote the book I wish I had. I wish there was a manual for a dummy like me who was just running an ordinary business to figure out how to get a client end to end. You know, how, where do I start?
Allan: And in my first book, the one page marketing plan, I literally give the definition of marketing. I assume nothing because I knew nothing about marketing when I was first getting started. So I think the most valuable books are the books that are written from that perspective. From, from the perspective of it’s the book I wish I had, you know, it’s the itch I needed to scratch. And similar in most markets, I mean, I hear people talking about when they’re in the SaaS business, you know, write the, you know, you code the tool that you wish you had, you know, like Slack, for example, was a tool that they were just using internally. They’d coded for themselves because they needed to be able to chat internally while they were developing games or whatever it was. So that was number one.
Allan: Number two definitely was a positioning and authority tool. You know, to be an authority, I think it’s important that you be an author. So the word authority has author in it. And then the third part was definitely lead flow. And the books generate a ton of leads for our business. And it’s no accident that I have resources scattered throughout the book. Number one is because I think it enhances the book dramatically because there’s only so much you can do in a physical book or a written book. And then those resources enhance. They give you opportunities to actually implement some of the stuff in the book. But also they’re a great way to capture leads. So we have people join our email list. And again, it’s not just spam here, buy my stuff, buy my stuff.
Allan: It actually just extends the journey of the book where people absolutely love being on our email list. And sometimes if I’ve gone a while and I haven’t written an email, I mean, happens Less these days because I’ve got a team who keeps me on my toes. But back in the day I’d get emails from people say hey, you haven’t sent anything out in a while. They’re looking out for my emails. And that’s what I mean by your marketing should be something that adds so much value that it would be missed if you didn’t do it.
Stacy: I think that’s so helpful for people that are, especially those who are just starting to get serious about their marketing. Maybe they’ve had starts and stops and maybe they’ve been in business for a little while, but they really want to grow. And in lead marketing you have some specific tips around email. I’m glad you brought this up. And some of them were really validating for me. Like you ask for replies. I’ve been doing that forever. And I was like, oh, that’s a strategy great. And I’ve noticed that it does help with deliverability. But I really love the way that you just phrased this approach to your email list in that it adds value that people look, they want to read it. And I’m curious if you could maybe give our listeners and viewers a couple of tips in their email marketing.
Stacy: That one would help them maybe posture a little bit differently when they write their emails and think about it a little differently and then maybe a couple of practical things that they could be thinking about, like asking for a reply.
Allan: Sure. Well, let’s talk about the reply aspect of things because a lot of people treat email like a broadcast medium, which is not so typically. A lot of people will send emails and it’s like a one way street. I’m sending you my broadcast. And they kind of treat it like, you know, like any other broad, like a TV broadcast medium or radio broadcast meeting, but it’s just in text. And that’s such a huge missed opportunity because first of all, if someone replies to one of your emails now, they’re essentially whitelisted and Google or whatever email provider they’re using will say, oh, this is actually a two way street. They, they actually reply to those emails. So that’s kind of the technical factor and working in your favor.
Allan: But much more important than that, if you’ve got a business behind your book, the thing that you want is to have conversations with your ideal target market. Right? You want to have a two way dialogue. And a lot of people kind of push to getting on a phone call or a zoom call or whatever and they will be your hottest prospects who will book a zoom call or Phone call with you or whatever and that’s totally fine. But there will be people who are kind of sort of interested in what you do. Maybe the time is not right, maybe the budget’s not right. They be interested in what you’ve got to say what you’ve got to sell all of those sorts of things.
Allan: And having a way to have conversations with them in a very low friction way, in a very low pressure way is a very powerful thing. And we get a ton of reply. I expect replies to my emails. Some of my emails will, you know, ask people, hey, hit reply and tell me X, Y, Z or what’s the biggest challenge in your business right now. But a lot of email, a lot of our emails don’t necessarily have that specific call to action. But people still reply because they believe that there’s a real live human being and there is on the other end of that email.
Allan: And so to that end, some of the things that we want to do to make sure that to that people do reply and that they do believe that there is a live human being is send it from my name. So we’re not sending it from the company name, we’re not sending it from news at or sales at or the worst offender is no reply at to domain. And long story short, for a digital business, I think of it as like your storefront. You know, it’s like if you were manning a store, if you had a physical store, if somebody walked in you’d be like, oh, hey, welcome to our store. Have you been here before? Okay, you haven’t been here. Oh, let me show you around.
Allan: This is our, you know, we’ve got a sale on these items where this is how we curate our collection and so on and so forth. And I think of that just as our digital storefront. It’s like, you know, someone’s opted into my list. I want to have a conversation with them. I want to, you know, have a two way street, see what’s a challenge going on in their business right now. Even if I can’t help them with my product or service, maybe I can direct them to the right place and just keep them engaged.
Stacy: I like that approach of it being a conversation. I think it also takes some of the pressure off when you’re writing the emails because rather than it needing to be this like perfectly polished pitch that you send out to people’s inboxes, you can really think about connecting with somebody and inviting that conversation with them. So I think that’s a really helpful tip, especially for anybody that does not look forward to writing their email newsletters, which used to be me. And I really understand that it can feel really daunting. But I do think with your approach, in all the things that I’ve kind of outsourced on my team, the things that I keep, which are small are, you know, this podcast, which, of course I need to be the one recording. I write all my newsletters. It’s part of it. And.
Stacy: And my personal content, because I actually really enjoy it. I think about the person on the other side that’s reading it.
Allan: Yeah. The other. The other tip I’ll give you is to think of it as you’re writing to one person. And so the best writing, both in books and in emails, is kind of just write how you would speak. I write my books how I would speak. I get rid of all of the professional jargon and things like that. So my books could have easily become textbooks. Right. And in fact, there’s probably about 20 or 30 universities that use my books as their, you know, their textbooks for their entrepreneurship or marketing program. But the feedback I get is they don’t read like textbooks. You know, I’ve got, you know, my own personal stories in there. I use language that I would use just speaking day to day. And so I don’t want someone to just be bored to death.
Allan: It can be the same information, but it can be delivered in a really boring, dry manner, or it can be interposed with stories and narrative and things that people actually want to read. So it’s kind of like the spoonful of sugar that helps the medicine go down. Right. So if I can make it easier to consume, easier to share something that people actually want to read, it makes a huge difference. Even if I’m delivering the exact same.
Stacy: Information, which is so counter to what people often think when they’re going in to write a nonfiction book, because they’re like, well, I don’t want to be fluffy. I don’t want to waste people’s time with stories. And to your point, when you’re in your books, when you’re telling stories, that’s how people remember what you’re teaching. It’s wrapped in a story that they’ll remember.
Allan: Yeah. We are hardwired as human beings to receive and recall information via story. I mean, you probably can’t recall half of what happened last week or last month, but if someone told you a compelling story that moved you emotionally, then you’ll remember that potentially for the rest of your life.
Stacy: Yeah. And to Your point? Your book is being used in universities. I bet those students love it because they’re like, finally, it’s not. Not so dry. One thing that I read in your bio that amazed me is that you have sold a million copies of your book. I also saw I’d been translated into 40 languages. So I’m going to ask you a real question in a second, but I’m just curious if you have experienced one of my bucket list items, which is to find one of, well, for me, but for your books in a, like a market in Southeast Asia copied somewhere. Have you ever seen that?
Allan: I haven’t found it in a market in Southeast Asia, probably because I’m not in South Asia very often. But I got one that’s pretty close. I got an email from a reader in Iran and he said, wow, I really enjoyed your book. I read it in Persian or whatever and I’m like, I’m pretty sure we haven’t sold any book rights to Iran and to be translated in Persian. And I, I looked it up. I thought maybe I’m crazy. Maybe we have. So I looked through all the languages that we had sold the book rights and of course it didn’t. So people in Iran are pirating my book and translating it into Persian. So that is, you can add that to the official language list, maybe, or unofficial language list.
Stacy: I love that. That is 100% goals. Okay, so that’s really impressive all the way around. How did you apply lean marketing to launching your book and continuing to sell it?
Allan: So I think I’m in a group of nonfiction authors and we talk all the time about what makes a hit book. And I wish I had the perfect formula. Everyone has a different theory and probably, to be honest, almost nobody really knows. But here’s my opinion. You’re having me on the podcast, I’ll give you my opinion. I think the concept is the thing that is the biggest factor because when you think about a book, there are a ton of factors. So there’s the quality of the writing. And, you know, I know some super best selling books that have horrible writing. And there are, you know, and the opposite. There are some books that are beautifully written that have sold almost no copies or very few copies.
Allan: So it’s not the quality of the writing, you know, it’s obviously good if you can be a good writer and write well. I think I’m kind of like maybe medium in that I’m definitely not in the top and I’m definitely not terrible. So I’m sort of Middle of the road there. But I think the concept being really solid, that would be number one. Like if I was thinking of a pyramid of what’s the most important thing I would think the concept. So like if you think of some of the best selling books, they make you feel like, wow, I want that, like a four hour work week, I want that. The life changing magic of tidying up. Wow. I want my life to be changed and magical. So all of those, almost all those books, a miracle morning.
Allan:I would love to have a miracle morning. Right? So there’s some concept that’s kind of counterintuitive, that feels kind of easy to implement. So the concept being really to me, that is absolutely the number one thing. The number two thing would be framework. So all of my books, well when I say all two of my books, and I’m currently writing my third one, they’re built on a framework. So people love, you know, it’s one thing to read a book that’s got kind of, you know, really good ideas, really good narrative, all of that sort of thing and then you finish it and you’re like, okay, what do I do now? I didn’t really change anything. So if you can have a, an easy to follow framework that someone can implement either in their life or in their business, that makes a huge difference.
Allan: So for me, in the one page marketing plan, the nine blocks of the one page marketing plan are the nine chapters of my book. They’re the nine modules of my course, they’re the nine steps we take through people in our coaching program. So a framework is a really powerful thing. So for me, number one would be concept, number two would be framework, and then number three would be story. So how can we? Because again, there’s really nothing new that I’ve invented in any of these books. Right, Everyone. You know, these are best, maybe best practice email marketing things that we talked about. There’s best practice things in terms of target market, messaging, all of those things.
Allan: Almost nothing in my books is something that I’ve invented, but I’ve packaged it up, I’ve curated the best of the best and put it in an easy to understand, easy to consume way with a framework that you can immediately implement in your business. So I think as non fiction authors, a huge part of the value we bring is the curation. So bringing together all, and especially now when there’s a billion podcasts, there’s YouTubes, there’s other books, there’s chat, GPT, there’s all of these things, the biggest service we can do to a lot of our audience is say, look, ignore all of those things. These are the five things that are really important for you that’s going to make the biggest difference.
Allan: So curating those best of the best things and putting it and packaging it in a way that’s really easy to understand and easy to implement.
Stacy: I love that you focused on the book positioning and content as your reply to that question, because I was more expecting some of the marketing strategies. But you went straight to creating an incredible book that will be. I often describe it as fertile soil from which other things can grow. And you’re making that just an. An incredible shelf, stable piece of content that will last and last in your.
Allan: The other reason for that is I’ve seen, and I’ve seen this from some huge authors where you can sell a few hundred thousand copies just by brute force because you’ve got the right connections to the right social channels. You’ve run a lot of ads, you’ve kind of pushed it a. But you can definitely do that. You can sell a few hundred copies, but to sell a few hundred thousand copies that way. But to crack a million and to sell millions, people have to recommend the book to other people. People have to be able to say, look, this was an awesome book. You should read it. Or this really helped me out, you should read it. So I don’t.
Allan: I think in terms of products, a book is almost the closest thing we have to a pure meritocracy where, you know, very few crappy books ever sell over a million copies or millions of copies. It’s very rare. Like, you would have to be a huge celebrity, I think, to be able to do that for everybody else, it’s got to be word of mouth. It’s got to be people recommending it to their friend, recommending it to their colleagues. I mean, you and I were talking before this podcast and you said, hey, I’m sharing it with my team of five people. And then, who knows, they might share it with their friend or their colleague.
Stacy: Or our listeners and viewers today as well, you know, on this conversation.
Allan: Exactly, exactly. So these are things that you just can’t. This is reach. You just can’t have with ads and with, you know, a social media push or a big email blast or whatever. Those things can be a nice launch pad and they can kind of get your first few hundred readers or first few thousand readers. But to get traction, and especially for it to be like a perennial bestseller over years and Years. It’s just gotta be something that people will recommend.
Stacy: Love that. Love, love. All right, I want to shift our conversation a little bit, because we’ve been talking about marketing. I’m sure that is the main thing that you talk about on every single podcast that you go on, but I know from learning about you and your life that you also are really passionate about living a rich life. And you know this. When we talk about marketing, it’s not do great marketing so you can do more marketing. It’s this. Marketing should lead to something important and meaningful that grows because of it. So could you tell us a little bit about how you think of this idea of a rich life?
Allan: Yeah, it comes about a lot from discussions I’ve had with clients over the years. You know, we’ll start superficial, and it’ll be like, hey, I joined your program. I want to get to, you know, 10 million in revenue. And there’s this iterative process. And I talk about in lean marketing. It comes from the world of lean, originally lean manufacturing. It’s called the five whys. It’s like, you know, to give an example, so the production line broke down. So we ask why this. This particular part failed. This chain in the. In the motor or whatever failed. Okay, well, why. Why did that fail? Well, that failed because it wasn’t properly lubricated. Okay, well, why wasn’t it properly lubricated? Well, the. The engine overheated or something like that. That. Right. Oh, why did the engine overheat? Well, because the air conditioner failed.
Allan: Okay, why did the air conditioner fail? And, you know, by the fifth why, we get to you, and it’s not an exact science, not necessarily exactly five or whatever, but after a whole bunch of iterative asking why, we get to the root cause, and we find out, okay, there wasn’t a proper maintenance schedule for the air conditioner to replace the filter and make sure that it didn’t fail. So, you know, the. On the surface level, it’s because, you know, this part failed, but actually at the root cause, we find out we didn’t have a proper maintenance schedule for the air conditioner. Now, how this relates to living a rich life and marketing and all the things that I’m working on is, you know, I will talk to a client and, like, I want to get to 10 million in revenue. Okay, great.
Allan: Well, why is that? Well, I want to get to 2 million in profit. Okay, why do you want to get to 2 million in profit? Well, you know, that’s a figure that I’ve always had in mind. And, you know, that will help me achieve some of my goals and all that. Okay, well, tell me about some of your goals. And almost all of them come down to, hey, I want to live an incredible life on my own terms. And, you know, when it comes down to it comes down to a few different things. People want, you know, to feel like a hero to their family. Right? That is something that is core to most. Probably most people, but certainly most entrepreneurs, you know, they want to be. They want to provide an incredible life for their family, whatever that means for them.
Allan: Sometimes that means more time, sometimes that means more money. Sometimes. Usually it’s a combination of both. So I’m kind of trying to get to the root of what are we trying to do? So, yes, marketing is absolutely a vehicle that will help you build your business, it’ll help you grow your business, it’ll help you make more money, more profit, and things like that. But what is it that people actually want to. And that’s really to live a rich life. And often it comes down to a few key elements. You know, they want to be more present with family. They want to be a hero to their family. They want to live life a lot more intentionally. So. A lot of people are living life by default, but people who live a rich life live a very intentional life.
Allan: So they manage their time, they manage their money, they manage who they. Who they associate with. So there’s a lot of elements to living a rich life. But to me, it was about really who, you know, what is it that you actually, really want and being very clear with that.
Stacy: And what about for you? What is. What is your. Why that drives you?
Allan: So, I mean, I. I love the stories that I hear every day. You know, people who potentially plateaued in their business, and now they’re. Now, you know, business has grown. Now they’ve got a marketing framework that actually works for them. And while that sounds a little bit superficial on the top, like the stories that I hear, you know, people who were on, you know, and, you know, I talk in my books, I talk about sell people what they want, but give them what they actually need. So people come to us saying, hey, I want better marketing, I want to run marketing campaigns, I want more revenue in my business, all of those sorts of things.
Allan: But some of the conversations I’ve had behind the scenes with entrepreneurs, marketing is probably number 10 on the list that we actually, when we get down to real things, I mean, we’ve talked. I’ve talked to people about their relationships, their Divorces their, you know, things that are going on in their lives. And really, when it comes down to it, we’re all wanting the same stuff. We’re all wanting better lives for us and our families and our communities and the people around us. And, you know, on social media we’ve got all this crazy stuff where, you know, everyone’s trying to, you’re either on the right or you’re either on the left or you’re the enemy or you’re whatever.
Allan: And the reality is most people, regardless of their politics, regardless of their race or religion or whatever, they basically want a better life for themselves and for their community and for their families. And so I think that’s getting down to what are, what’s the real psychology behind what people actually want. And you know, of course, the people express it in different ways, sometimes in productive ways, unproductive ways, but really getting down to what is it that someone, somebody wants is super powerful. So for me, I love to see those transformations where someone was like, lost and now they’re found. They’re like, you know, finding that light switch. For someone who was kind of flailing.
Stacy: About in the dark, that is a very meaningful reason to keep showing up and doing the work that you do. I’m going to ask you the question that I ask every guest and that is if you could recommend just one book to our listeners. So this is one that has profoundly impacted you in some way. What book would that be? And why?
Allan: There’s so many. But probably the one that comes to mind maybe because he recently passed away. But Scott Adams, he wrote how to Fail at Almost Everything But Still Win big. I love that book. And you know, he became a little bit of a controversial character later on in his life and said some dumb stuff like probably we all do, but that is, that was a book that definitely impacted him. I love his writing, I love his thinking. And yeah, it was, it’s an excellent book.
Stacy: Well, thank you for that recommendation. I haven’t read it, so I will add it on my TBR list. Allan, where can our listeners and viewers follow you? Find out more about your work and get notified when your new book comes out.
Allan: Yeah, so I’m at leanmarketing.com my books are everywhere on Amazon, the one page marketing plan in Lean Marketing. And yeah, if you want to see some of our emails, just feel free to join the list. We’re at leanmarketing.com, you can enter your email address and you’ll be part of the conversation. As well.
Stacy: Thank you so much, Alan. I really appreciate you joining me today. It was a pleasure, Stacy, and thank you to you, our listeners and viewers, for being with us. And since you’re still here, you must have loved this conversation. So do be sure that you have some subscribed or followed along so you don’t miss future inspiring, useful conversations like this one. Thank you as always to Rita Domingues for her production of this podcast. If it was not for her, you would never, ever be watching or listening to this right now. She makes everything happen and I am grateful and I will be back with you before you know it.
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