In this week’s episode, I have the honor of welcoming Leslie (Lam) Miller, founder of Girl Friday Productions, for a candid conversation about what it really takes to build a values-driven business and partnership. We unpack how a culture of authenticity not only transforms teams but also client relationships.
Lam also shares practical guidance to help authors make smart publishing decisions, from understanding pricing and partnership fit to choosing quality over quick wins across the different publishing paths. We explore how AI is reshaping the industry, as we dig into ethical boundaries, creative integrity, and why real thought leadership will always demand real human thinking.
Lam also shares the exciting news of her brand-new book coming this April: When They Go Low, We Go Highball: Fifty Cocktails for Smashing the Patriarchy, a bold, feminist cocktail book that features all your favorite tipples but with a feminist twist.
This episode is a masterclass in building not just a book, but a better way of doing business rooted in authenticity, equality, and creative excellence.
Learn more about Lam:
Book recommendation:
- To Kill a Mockingbird, by Harper Lee
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- Instagram @stacyennis
- Facebook @stacyenniscreative
- YouTube @stacyennisauthor
To submit a question, email hello@stacyennis.com or visit stacyennis.com/contact and fill out the form on the page.
How to choose the right publishing partners (and honor your values) | Episode 239
These transcripts were generated by robots, not writers.
Stacy:Welcome. Welcome. I’m really excited about this week’s conversation, particularly because it’s with somebody that I have a really wonderful relationship with in the publishing industry. And I know for those of you who are working on your books or looking for people to partner with, sometimes it can feel a little overwhelming when you get into the industry and realize how many people you have to partner with to make your book a reality. So I hope that today’s conversation will give you some confidence you’ll learn a little bit about the publishing industry whether you are on book one, your first book, or you’re working on book two, three or beyond. We’ll also touch on AI and some of our expertise and ethical posturing toward AI as so many things are changing in this industry. So let me introduce you to this week’s guest.
Stacy:Leslie, also known as Lam Miller, is the co founder and CEO of Girl Friday Productions, an independently owned women led publishing services company delighting authors and brands since 2006. Renowned for strong client relationships, expert editorial and award winning design, GFP produces thoughtful, well crafted books across genres employing effective book positioning with tailored reader marketing strategies for each client. GFP is proud to support authors who educate, entertain and change lives. Lam welcome. I’m so happy to have you here.
Leslie (Lam): Thank you so much for having me. What a delight. Stacy:
I know all of us in this industry have an origin story and I would love to hear yours. What led you into the work that you do today? Supporting authors?
Leslie (Lam): I’ve been thinking about this a lot because girl Friday turns 20 this year and it’s interesting. Thank you. It is cool. Thinking back to the humble beginnings when it was my work wife, co founder Ingrid Emerick and I both worked at a traditional Publisher. She was the editorial director. I was the senior editor. And we both worked in acquisitions, actively edited in lists to build and put out. And it was before remote work really happened. This was 20 years ago, but we had just been acquired by a larger company. Very common story in publishing. So it was just the two of us out here, an outpost in Seattle, and everyone else was in New York. And were in our early 30s, and guess what were doing? We were having kids. And it was my first and Ingrid’s second.
Leslie (Lam): We were actually pregnant at the exact same time. We gave birth three days apart.
Stacy:Really? Oh, my gosh.
Leslie (Lam): Yes, were really pregnant at the exact same time. And following a very brief family leave time, went back to work and were really struggling. And we, you know, by day I was acquiring books on, you know, the false fight between stay at home mothers and working mothers while facing sort of really the same questions. Even though I was working at a feminist press, I was facing all of those questions and dilemmas and a fair lack of support in the workplace. It just didn’t exist. And we asked to have reduced hours, and they reduced our hours on paper and reduced our pay, but nothing else changed.
Leslie (Lam): And I don’t know if people know the glamour of being an acquisitions editor is that you do all of your work by day and at night you’re supposed to read all the manuscripts that you’re, you know, and so it’s. The work is ongoing and you’re sort of expected to do it in these off hours. And if you have a baby that also is up all night or anything else you want to do, those are in conflict. And after a while, we couldn’t do it anymore and said, there has to be a better way. We know that we can do our work and be mothers and do all of these other things if we had the right support, if the values were in place that really let us prioritize and manage our own time.
Leslie (Lam): And so we created our own company with those values at the center and with a vow that it wouldn’t just be for us. We never wanted anyone to have to go through this sort of false choice again.
Stacy:I am sure that so many listeners and viewers can really understand that. And I was thinking about my own experience with my babies and, you know, at the time I had my own business. But I went back after three weeks, and I remember coming home from the hospital, I think it was like two days after, and, you know, baby on my chest, typing on my laptop, trying to finish the project because he came early and you know, that balance is really tough. And I think also in our. One of the things I say to my husband a lot is like, I cannot ever be clicked out. Like, I have to always be clicked in. Like, this type of work, your brain has to be firing to be good at it. You can’t. You can’t skate by.
Stacy:So I imagine for you at that time, it was especially tough because you’re also. Then there’s like, you want to still kind of prove that you’re still fully there for your job. So I’m sure there was, like, a lot of tension going on for you at that time.
Leslie (Lam): Absolutely. And what. And the tension doesn’t go away. I mean, you’re still going to have this sort of, you know, firing on all cylinders job, as you say, it’s very creative, it’s very intellectual. Then becoming an entrepreneur as well. Then you’re a business owner. You’re wearing every single hat. You’re doing all of the things as well as being a parent. But I think when you take away the judgment and sort of the. Let’s not talk about the reality. I mean, in the United States, we’re still there. Every single new parent has to. You can’t afford childcare. You have to. I went back after a month, too, and I was like, this is insane. This is insane. I feel crazy. I’m like, brushing crumbs off my kid’s head and breastfeeding him while I’m. It was the exact same thing.
Leslie (Lam): And women still have to do it. But I think the difference that we wanted to make is that one of my employees said to me, she used to work at a large corporation and came over and she said, the amount of energy that I used to expend in not being me at work, that I get to put toward my work here is incredible. She was like, not having to mask and change who I am when I walk through the door, but being valued for who I am and being able to talk about all of these aspects of my life. It was life changing for her, and it was life changing for us. Just not to have that judgment and to have accommodation. It doesn’t make it easier all the time, but it changes how you feel about it.
Stacy:Yeah. To, you know, not only build it for yourself, but then build it for your team. And then, you know, inevitably that then trickles down to clients and success of the business as a whole. And I think one of the things that our. Our teams share and in you and I and our teams have met many times together, I think we have a lot of similar culture in our businesses. While, of course, ultimately excellence on the end is the most important thing, I actually think that the team being happy and well supported and joyful in their work is the absolute most important thing. Because you can’t deliver excellence on the other side. If, of course, I’m not perfect at this, none of us are.
Stacy:But at least aspiring to build that space and doing your best to create a space where people can be autonomous and pursue their interests and build the business and show up, I think that’s something that your team does extraordinarily well. I’m curious, you know, as you think about your services and the work that you do with authors, how do you see your team culture impacting the books that you put out in the world as a publisher?
Leslie (Lam): No, I’m really glad you brought that up. And I do think it’s this affinity that you and I have, because you can spot it, you can feel it. When I talk to anyone on your team, not just you, sort of this warmth and joy and enthusiasm comes through. And of course, you can imagine how much better work people do when that’s their, you know, mind space coming in. But I think that, you know, starting from the beginning and we know from taking people through to the end of publishing is such a vulnerable act. It doesn’t matter what you’re writing about, whether this is a memoir or these are your business principles or it’s fiction, this is something that is so personal to you and ultimately your goal is to show it to the world. And it terrifies people. They don’t usually recognize that.
Leslie (Lam): And sometimes it’s. They ask tons of questions. Sometimes they want to stop and like, take along, you know, but all of it is this dealing with this intimacy and vulnerability that they’re, you know, they’re about to show themselves to strangers and really ask them to like and appreciate their work. And so this kind of empathy and saying this can be joyful. It should be joyful. It shouldn’t be scary, it shouldn’t be punitive. This should be the most magnificent creative collaboration that brings you through to these fantastic interactions that you’re going to have with your readers. And we really believe and embody. That’s how it should be. We are amazing at what we do. You are amazing at what you do. And we’re also people and we’re fun and authentic and have curiosity and joy.
Leslie (Lam): And why would you not want to have this journey be that way if you could make that choice instead of Another way that sometimes that’s how it goes.
Stacy:I think the fun piece is such a fun piece of it. And it’s interesting because that, you know, I’ve talked about this a little in the podcast in the past, but, you know, when I was younger, I was so afraid of being too silly or too whatever because I thought I wouldn’t be professional enough. And I think now that I’m older, I’m really established. I’m like, where can I have fun? Where can I infuse sparkle and joy and silliness and. But of course, with excellence, with professionalism, with follow through, all those things too. But, you know, like, I have, I, I have a jacket, like a sequin jacket that I wear when people finish their drafts now, you know, to our calls, love it. Like, why not have things like that in the journey?
Stacy:Because it doesn’t have to be like suffering pain and dismay. It couldn’t be.
Leslie (Lam): No.
Stacy:It can be fun and exciting.
Leslie (Lam): No, absolutely. And I think that unfortunately you and I know that when we get to be silly as women, oftentimes we aren’t given as many chances as men too. And to be called professional at the same time, that is the great thing about reaching middle age is I also do not care. I am here I am world. But when I listen in on some of the calls that folks are having with clients or talking to them myself, that’s what they’re sharing is someone the other day opened up with a poem that she had just written about Renee Good. And they were both crying on the phone. Someone, you know, shares that they are having a baby or that they, I mean, they’re personal, they want this joy too. And so I think that they’re hungry for it and they match it.
Leslie (Lam): And then you have like this true collaborative relationship in sort of in excellence, as you said, but in joy. It’s, it’s special.
Stacy:I love that. Yeah. And I think there’s also. We’re kind of taught that we have to have this, like, only a professional relationship with people. And you can’t really blur those lines. I’ve had way more fun when I’ve blurred those lines a bit. You know, I had like, I know about their life, they know about my life. Happy birthday. Did you have a great. You know, it’s like those things, I don’t know why we have to be so like, not human in our relationships, professional or otherwise. So I love that you brought that up. One of the things that I Think authors get really overwhelmed with not. I think. I know authors get really overwhelmed with. Is when they jump into this industry, they feel really just like kind of at sea. There’s a.
Stacy:There’s a lot of different people who’ve all kind of made up how they work. There’s not really like one set industry deliverable standard that they can go and compare apples to apples. They get ghosted, they get burned, they get bad work. I just spoke with somebody recently who had. Who was like, ready to sign with a couple twice with people, and they just were gone. Like they. They just disappeared.
Leslie (Lam): Yeah.
Stacy:And. And I always. So I feel so much for them because I’ve. I’ve been on. I remember when I’ve been in earlier stages of my business and trying to hire like an ads person or marketing support. Now we have the amazing Rita, so I don’t have to go through that pain anymore. But, you know, going through those experiences, getting burned, not being sure that you’re spending your money wisely. A lot of times when people come to me, it’s not so much the actual investment. It’s more that they just don’t want to be taken advantage of. They want to make sure that they’re getting their value from it and that they’re not, you know, they’re not going to like, pay for something and not get something on the other side, which makes complete sense.
Stacy:I wondered if you could give listeners some advice on this as they are selecting partners, moving between different stages from maybe one partner to another partner. How do you make sure that you’re working with somebody who’s legit?
Leslie (Lam): Sure. No, it’s a great question and it does. It makes me so sad too, when we talk to folks who have been burned, who worked with someone, who didn’t understand them, who took their money and ran. Who. It doesn’t. It’s. It’s hard when we’re in this position. It’s so unfathomable to us. But I know that. I know that’s the reality that there are some bad actors out there and that it’s a. It is a very weird industry. It’s. It’s sort of. Sort of mystifying. It has an odd business model and it’s shifted a lot in the last few decades. And so it’s completely understandable that people are a bit at sea, especially if they’re new to it. But I think one of the best things you can do is if you’ve found someone who you trust and shares their values, is talk to them.
Leslie (Lam): It’s just like in any business, if you can get a referral from someone that you love and trust and who understands what your end goals are, I mean, you’re halfway there. I think it’s fantastic. Now it’s easier, I think with social media, with the web, with the amount of material that we put out there, it’s easier to investigate and research and actually do your due diligence about companies. There are some great advocacy organizations like Ally, who actually rate people and give them a green or a yellow or a red and they say why? And they’re independently assessing companies and saying who they should work with. But mostly it’s about asking the right questions and being able to. Just like the first time when we spoke about certain things.
Leslie (Lam): But when you have a conversation with someone and you ask about their culture, ask about what is important to them about the process, see if they listen to you about what your goals are. I mean, we talked to someone the other day who said, I talked to someone else. They just kept talking to me about being in airport bookstores. That isn’t what I want. What I want is this. And were just listening to her and saying, your goals are our goals. I’m not going to try and persuade you.
Leslie (Lam): For this other dream. And there is, I think, also questioning the assumptions of what we’ve been fed about. I’ve already demystified the romance of being an acquisitions editor, but it’s. There is no best way. And so really it’s finding someone who will honor you by allowing you to take your own publishing path from writing through and then finding the right partners to go with you on your journey.
Stacy:That’s a wonderful advice. And I was also thinking that sometimes it’s really hard for people to compare pricing. You get maybe a quote from one person and then another person that’s like 4x maybe what this person is charging. And that can be really tricky for people to determine, you know, because it’s like, well, why would I pay four times the amount when this person seems just as good? And I could just do this. What would you tell people when they’re kind of dealing with that? Because I, I come across this all the time, especially with my coaching. People come in, you know, we have a conversation and they’re like, well, I met somebody and they’re way less expensive than you. And I’m like, great. Sometimes you just have a budget and that’s all you have to work with.
Stacy:But if you have the budget and you want to be mindful in how you’re spending. How should people be thinking about these vast differences sometimes in the quotes that they’re getting?
Leslie (Lam): You should definitely be taking people’s experience into account. Someone who’s been doing this as long as you have, who has this long track record, how much time are they spending? How robust is the experience that they’re going to get? We have folks who come to us who say they gave us this quote and we say that quote doesn’t include any editorial production. You will need that and you’re maybe going to pay for that separately because you do need it. And so it’s a. They’ve lowered their prices sort of artificially. It’s not, this is not a process where you want to cut corners. And it is absolutely fair to say I have this much money to spend and I don’t have more than that.
Leslie (Lam): But for us, I know that, you know, when people say, big ticket item, we’re like, it is a big ticket item. We’re going to have 10 people working with you on your book for nine months. These are skilled, vetted editors, designers, the best of the best. We’re going to curate them and spend an incredible amount of time with you, getting you to your goals. And it’s a very personalized experience. And so I think the apples to apples is huge. You really need to ask a lot of questions. It’s not like buying a car at that car lot versus this car lot. If it’s five grand less, sure, buy the car over there. It’s not that experience. It’s more like a contractor. And what are they going to do for you and what is the full breadth of what they’re going to save you from?
Leslie (Lam): Or how much attention in your case, how much attention care and how much are you going to instruct them and, you know, pass on these skills so that they actually can write a book at the end. I mean, that’s incredible. And that’s very different than someone giving you a few notes on the narrative structure of your book. Those are really different outcomes.
Stacy:I mean, to your point, it’s like every, well, not every, but I would say there’s certain people in our industry that have a specific specialty, a niche, an area of focus and expertise that makes them stand out. It makes them the, you know, the higher end partners to work with.
Leslie (Lam): Yes.
Stacy:And just like anything, like buying a car, even like the surgeon that you get at the hospital, you know, it actually does very. For a reason. Typically, yes. And I was also thinking, I bet you’ve had this happen too, that I’ve had people who come to me go a different route. A year later they will come back and I’m always like, you know, just heartbroken for them because now it’s not only costing a lot more, but it’s also. It’s not just money, is it? It’s. It’s actually for a lot of the people that we’re working with, it’s. It’s their time, it’s their energy. They want to do it right. They don’t. They want to shortcut a lot of the process so that they’re not having to learn through mistakes. Yeah.
Stacy:Do you have that happen too, that people will come to you after working with another publisher?
Leslie (Lam): Absolutely, Absolutely. And we have folks who have gone and, you know, traditional publishing is always the holy grail who then come back and say they didn’t. This is not a universal experience. I am not trashing traditional publishers. But I was a small fish on this big list, which is just true. They didn’t give me marketing support. I didn’t know what to do. I didn’t get a proper edit. They put me into copy edit. They’re facing a lot of pressure over there to make their P. L’s work. And so, you know, they got what they thought was the prize, but they were like, the prize for me actually is this amazing experience and I want to come back and have that again. So it is sad. We’re always, we’re always glad to have them back. But absolutely, it is true because it’s.
Leslie (Lam): It wounds them and then it’s hard to, you know, anyone who’s been wounded, they. They’re slow to build trust again. We can do it, you know, it’s hard.
Stacy:Yeah. Okay. I wanted to talk a little bit about AI because of course this is having such a huge impact on our industry. And I know we’ve talked about this off, you know, offline, but our online, not on the pod. I’ve had so many authors come that have done some of their initial ideation with ChatGPT. They’ve uploaded like all of their content to ChatGPT. Basically, they’ve outsourced their thinking at the very beginning of the process, which is to me just absolutely the opposite of what you should be doing in the creative process. You never want to outsource your thinking. You don’t want to outsource generation and reasoning. You don’t want to outsource any of that at any stage of your life. But certainly in the book writing process, there’s a lot of Things that I’m navigating right now in my own work with authors.
Stacy:One of the lines in the sand that I’ve drawn with my coaching clients is that I will not work with AI generated content. So I do require my authors to actually write their books. And I feel a really strong ethical responsibility to hold that space. I know we’ve even talked about, like, there needs to be some kind of badge or, you know, like a. Like a label or something that’s like, these are written by real humans. What are you seeing? How has, first of all, how has your inbox changed and your conversations changed and what are some of the things that you’re like, navigating as a publisher right now with AI?
Leslie (Lam): I mean, many of the same. We. I was recently at an industry conference and half of the conversations were about AI, and these were folks who were doing writing. And the, you know, the conversation sort of landed on, don’t use it to write. Use it to help with research, which you then have to verify because there are a lot of hallucinations in the research that there were folks who spent a lot of time training the AI and said, you got better outcomes. Sort of the more when you said, you know, that study doesn’t exist and then that it apologizes and then, you know, gives you a different, maybe real study as answer. Anyway, the research is a bit fraught, I would say, although definitely speeds things up. People don’t understand that when they upload their content, they are giving it to the world.
Leslie (Lam): They’re giving it to the corporation to train their machine. And I think what people really don’t understand is that there’s not a being on the other side that is helping you ideate. What it’s doing is combing through and finding, pattern matching and giving you back what it thinks you would like and would be most useful. And I’m not. AI is here. It is not. In the last two months, the amount that we’ve had to deal with it tenfold, Everything from folks who are saying, here’s the COVID I want. We have cover designers lined up. We know everything about the genre of the book and what sells and how it should look in the marketplace and how the packaging and positioning is really important. And they’re like, but I had this idea and I fed it in and it gave me a design that they.
Leslie (Lam): It stole sort of from some other designer. So there’s of course, the plagiarism question, which is difficult. There is the intellectual property question, which is difficult. I am an author who have I have three books that are listed in the anthropic settlement about being used to train AI without my permission. We have to slow down. I think it is absolutely our obligation to, as a culture to slow down and think critically about it. We have this shiny new toy and people are just going nuts with it without thinking really through the ramifications. And why do you think that what it’s giving back to you is better than what I.
Stacy:It’s easier. I think that’s what it is it’s, it’s. It’s the shortcut, you know, rather than putting it. Rather than struggling through the ideation. And you know, I think one thing that I’m hopeful about, Lam, is that our clients, the ones that were. That we are guiding and shepherding into creating these amazing books, people that put in the work and the thinking and the artistry and the attention and the human creativity, their books are going to be in demand, I believe, compared to this homogenous blob of sameness that is coming out of so many people. Yeah. And I, you know, the other thing is like, it’s interesting because I’m working on a book right now and part of my process is working through comp titles for this book that I’m working on.
Stacy: And for anybody who doesn’t know what that is, just comparative analysis or competitive analysis of other books that your book could kind of fit with but adds to the, adds to the conversation. And you know, in theory I could plug in my book and say give me comp titles. But I have chosen to put hours of time into going through this and working through this. And that process has given me so much richness that has added to my book ideas points. You know, I’m like making all these connections and that like that. That’s where thought leadership comes from, is through leading through thought and putting in the work and struggling through it and thinking about it.
Stacy:You know, it’s that I think our clients, the people in our, you know, that are like them doing this kind of work, they’re going to rise way above. Leslie (Lam):
I absolutely agree with you. And I think that working with someone like you guys at the beginning and giving them the confidence to do that they can do that their ideas themselves are worthy and better. We do the same thing with comp analysis. I mean, I’ve been approached by many people. Do all of your marketing just with AI get rid of all of your marketing people. Do all of your editorial. You know, do you. That’s not. Someone at the conference said, don’t write your book with AI Just use it for developmental editing and oh, don’t do that. And I, I vocalized in opposition at my table, what? No, I mean, it’s. Spellcheck can catch errors. That’s not, it’s not, we’re not talking about the same process or output or what’s going into it.
Leslie (Lam): But I, the other part that made me sad is not only this thought leadership and the richness of going through that intellectual exercise, but also even when they were talking about, you know, when I’m looking for phrasing or Jane Friedman has said, I use it to generate headlines for articles. I hate writing headlines. And so I use it for that. And it was interesting when the writers were all talking about, you know, I feed it in when I’m really puzzling over something. To me, that’s the richest part of writing. That’s when you get through that. It’s like you’re trying to do the New York Times crossword. And I do this a lot and I can’t get the clue. And I think about it. I could go look it up and fill it in.
Leslie (Lam): But when I’ve puzzled through and then I’m like, yes, and I get it and it falls into place. To me, that’s how it feels in writing. When I’m stuck being stuck, there’s a lesson I’m supposed to learn and I’m not going to learn the lesson if I take this other path and allow someone else to solve it for me. So I agree with you. It’s richer material because it’s hard fought and I’m not a Luddite. I’m not saying it’s here, it’s going to happen. It pops up on my computer every day. We need to figure out how. We have an industry standard right now. I think the best thing is for people to be very open about their use.
Stacy:Yes, I agree. Leslie (Lam):
We ask that of our clients. It’s part of our contract. We have some contractors who will not work on a manuscript that has been generated with AI. Designers, of course, are very touchy about that for obvious reasons. And now we’ve seen there was just this case where there was a book that was nominated for a prize and they eliminated it because the COVID design, which I didn’t find particularly compelling, had been done with AI. And so, you know, as an industry, we’re reacting in these sort of disparate ways, but it’s, we do need to keep having this conversation.
Stacy:Yeah, it’s Interesting because I’m, you know, sometimes I’m like, I don’t want to be like a fuddy duddy that’s like, oh, my technology is coming in. And, you know. But at the same time, I don’t see a difference between AI generation and plagiarism in the vast majority of cases because, you know, especially in the stage that I work in, and I would say also particularly because of the kind of books that I work with, these are people that, like, the journey matters to them and to me. And then of course, that you’re pulling from other people’s work to generate this. So how can that not be plagiarism? And then I think, you know, the other piece that authors don’t think about.
Stacy:To your point, when you’re feeding it out into the ecosystem, you lose the rights to your work because you’ve now fed it into the ecosystem. So I, I haven’t verified this, but I heard a story from a publishing professional about somebody who, like a publisher, wouldn’t work with them because they had fed their manuscript into chat or cloud or something, and it didn’t pass the AI check later on because it was now in the ecosystem. So these are all things that also, authors need to be protecting themselves in their own work. And thinking about that, I’m also curious to know, just as a business owner, you know, how are you thinking about this in your own work? Like, one of the ways that I’m.
Stacy:One thing I’m noticing that’s really interesting is that people are talking to ChatGPT about me, you know, and whether they.
Leslie (Lam): Should have worked with me or.
Stacy:Yeah, like a. A vetting tool. I know, like, oh, that’s. I mean, I hope. I’m sure it’s saying nice things, but it just makes me a little have, you know, have you had that happen too?
Leslie (Lam): It’s interesting. We have been. Since we’re, you know, we monitor where the. How clients find us and their path to us. And Chat GPT has been ticking up. So right now, Chat GPT seems to think favorably of Girl Friday, but at what point does it not. And there was this. There was an interesting tool that was as part of our website checker, and it allowed us to ask a question that a potential client might ask and see what companies came up in response. I had never heard of a one of them and it was fat. And I was curious. I mean, there’s some reason they mined something.
Leslie (Lam): To serve up these companies to me. And so, yes, clients are using this and really trusting what the output is. AIgives false information all the time. It also is rooted in a certain time and place, certain things. For us, working with uploading a manuscript and how that displays in online retailers, it changes every day. It changes every five minutes. We have to stay on top of it constantly. And now all of our clients are saying, well, you told me this. I fed it into ChatGPT. Chat said this, so shouldn’t we do this instead? And so I. I know that. I understand, I guess, the appeal, but it is really difficult navigating the. Please trust us. Please trust us that we are not. We’re on top of it. We know more than chat does about this. We are not giving a magic answer.
Stacy:That, you know, there’s no discernment.
Leslie (Lam): There’s no discernment. There is no discernment. And it’s hard. Our. Our publishing managers have said, oh, you know, this is. It’s taking twice the time to sort of have to re. Educate after a different answer has been given by some AI. And it’s. It’s a little frustrating.
Stacy:Yeah, yeah, it’s interesting. I’m sure it’s just gonna be an evolving conversation that’s, like, sometimes a little stressful. So I think that’s a good segue into your forthcoming book that’s coming out in April because it has cocktail recipes, which is a nice balance to. To stress, but it’s not just recipes. Can you tell us about your book and. And also its activism angle?
Leslie (Lam): Yes. So it’s called When They Go low, we go highball 50 cocktails to fight the Patriarchy. We are. We have a very specific culture at Girl Friday and a very specific set of values. We’re also 18 women to lovely feminist men. It just happens to work out that way. We’re open. We’re open to all men working at Girl Fridays, but that just happens to be the balance there. It has been. It’s a difficult time for us and for our team in terms of what has happened since last January, politically, socially, culturally in the United States around women’s rights and conversation around gender and gender ideology, dei, et cetera. Really rageful, really sad. It’s difficult to just. Every day it was just, you know, this onslaught of news stories. And so the team actually came up with this idea. We’re publishers. We get to.
Leslie (Lam): We love creating our own content. We’re unusual in that way. We’ve created our own content various times and published books on our own. And that’s when we felt really passionate about. And so the idea was the teams and Then it was handed over to me to execute and go write this. Yeah, I have a day job, but I still squeezed this one in. And so it is. All of the recipes are they really. Each one highlights some aspect of feminism or gender equity that we felt was in peril or worth mentioning. And there are role models in there. There are ways to get involved. So it’s not just it went from a rage drinking focus to really focus on power and community and how do we band together to claw these rights back. And it’s very fun. It’s very tongue in cheek. Leslie (Lam): The drinks are all excellent. I will say I have personally either created or tested all of them and it’s just nice. It’s been this really a galvanizing project for our company and I hope it feels that way for the women and men who buy it and gift it and celebrate the power of women.
Stacy:Yeah. I’ve also, I got a sneak peek and it’s a beautiful little book. It’s so pretty. And I know you include mocktails in there too, so it’s inclusive. It’s inclusive as well in that way.
Leslie (Lam): It is inclusive, yes. The mocktails are tasty.
Stacy:Well, we can’t wait to celebrate the release in April. Is there already a like website up about it or is there. How would, how would our viewers and listeners learn more and be notified when it’s released?
Leslie (Lam): Well, you could pre order it now on your favorite online retailers, so go ahead and do that if you’d like. But the website is being developed as we speak. It will be wegohighball.com so you can go there or you can always go to girlfriday productions.com and we will continue to give updates because we’re very excited. Nice.
Stacy:And is that a Michelle Obama nod with the.
Leslie (Lam): It is indeed a Michelle Obama nod.
Stacy:I love it. That’s great. Oh, we’ve had such a rich conversation today and I, I would love to kind of synthesize this in, you know, anybody who’s listening to this again, they might be working on their first book. They might be. Maybe they had a mediocre experience with their first book and now they’re working on their second and they really want to have that incredible experience. What advice would you give to anyone listening or watching as they’re considering the right publishing pathway for their book?
Leslie (Lam): I really want people to try and put to the side the notions about what is best, the most validating, what’s going to sound the best to their neighbor, their idea of what being a published author is. I want Them to really focus on what are their goals, who do they want to work with, and how do they want to get there? Because the fact of the matter is, whether you go with traditional or hybrid or self publishing, there is not. You can end up with a gorgeous book no matter what. You can end up with a book that’s available to all of your readers, no matter what. What the difference is who is paying the money, the timeline and control. So really think about those factors. Do you have the budget to invest upfront in a hybrid pathway or in self publishing?
Leslie (Lam): Those are really viable and wonderful. And I would say even the most popular and beneficial to the widest amount of authors, that’s how you’re going to get. Your goal is to get your books into the hands of readers. If you pay enough money, you can get a billboard in Times Square. You can get a pile of books in placement in a Barnes and Noble. That’s about money. So really just think about, what do I want my book to do? How do I want to feel about it? And is it that there’s some logo on the spine that most readers are never going to look at? They don’t know what the imprint is, or that it’s a book you’re incredibly proud of, and that one reader writes to you and says, this changed my life. This changed my perspective. I learned so much. Thank you.
Leslie (Lam): Does it help you in your work? Is it your calling card? Is it, you know, emblematic of your leadership or of something greater in the world that you want to do? Just really whatever that goal is, support that goal, focus on that goal and then everything else, align it to that, and I think you’ll be golden.
Stacy:That’s wonderful advice. It was unexpected. I wasn’t. I wasn’t expecting that. But that was perfect and beautiful. Okay, I’m gonna ask you a very hard question. This is the question that I ask all of my. All of my guests. But it’s especially hard because you’re a publisher and book lover. What if you could recommend one book to listeners and viewers? This is one that has profoundly impacted your life.
Leslie (Lam): Yes.
Stacy:What would it be and why? Leslie (Lam): This is such a hard question. And I know every single person you ask is like, that’s a terrible.
That’s such a hard question.
Stacy:But it’s harder for you, I think, than for most.
Leslie (Lam): I know. And I love so many different types of books. And I. You know, I was. I was thinking, should it be where the Red Fern Grows? Because I have three hound dogs and they’re. It has had a profound impact on my life. I married my husband because we bonded over Song of Solomon. I was like, should it an incredible book. But in the end, I decided on To Kill a Mockingbird. One of my sons is named Atticus, after Atticus Finch. But there’s one, I think, because this entire conversation has been really about values and integrity. There is a moment in To Kill a Mockingbird that has always stuck with me.
Leslie (Lam): And it’s when Scout, the little girl, is talking to Ms. Maddie, her neighbor, and they’re having a conversation about how Atticus Finch, Scout’s father, doesn’t treat his children any differently in the house than he does in the yard. And Ms. Maudi says of Atticus, he is the same in his house as he is on the public streets. And Tommy’s got chills. I mean, that’s. That’s it, right? I mean, to me, that is such a guiding principle. Live your life, including with your clients, authentically and with integrity. And if you are always the same and everything you’re saying to everyone has that ring of truth and transparency and in service to others, then it’s all going to turn okay. And so to me, that’s just. It’s a beautiful principle and one I really try to live up to.
Stacy:I love that. Thank you, Liam. Thank you for sharing and thank you so much for joining me. I really appreciate your time and you sharing all of your wisdom with our listeners and our viewers.
Leslie (Lam): Well, likewise. You’re incredible. And thank you so much for having me on the podcast, which I love so much.
Stacy:And thank you to you, our listeners and viewers, for hanging out with us today. If you are still listening or watching, you must have really enjoyed this, so be sure that you are subscribed. And if you have a moment to rate and review the podcast or leave a comment on YouTube, I would really appreciate it. Not only will it help you get more of these great interviews, but it will also help me reach more people with the message of living a life that’s not just better, but beyond better. And I always have to thank Rita Dominguez because as I say every week, if she did not, she was not part of this. This would never make it to your ears or your eyes. She is the reason that this podcast happens, and I am grateful. And I will be back with you before you know it. Instagram at Stacey Ennis or on Facebook at Stacey Ennis, Creative, thank you so much for joining me this week. Here’s to building lives that are beyond better.
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